A little attempt at self-analysis
Mar. 5th, 2007 10:35 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
pensnestWell, now. ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
turps33 was wondering where the pop meta is... I dunno that I'm up to starting off any topics that fit the definition she and withdiamonds have suggested, but I have been doing some vague musings about writing, and possibly someone else might like to muse along with me? If we stick to popslash, we'll all know who we're talking about.
I've been thinking about this for a while: I think it stems from one of the Writing Memes that goes around every so often. There was a question in there along these lines: which of your stories is the most revealing?
You see, I never used to think I was *in* my stories. When I was a Trekkie it wasn't really the kind of discussion that tended to happen, at least, not between Dataphiles, and I didn't really think about it, I just wrote what seemed to me to be something that was worth writing. But of late, I have at least begun to notice that I am indeed in there.
It can be in the simple things - like, if I have Justin admiring the pretty picture Lance makes when he's eating a strawberry, that's mostly me in there thinking it would be awful nice to see Lance eating a strawberry. Yes. I mean, I think it's obvious that if I'm trying to present a hot image, I need to believe it's a hot image. Why are so many of us delighted by fics involving masturbation, especially masturbation-with-an-observer? I'm pretty sure that's the same kind of thing.
The next step down, though, is to notice the way my own preferences come through. See, when I put Chris and Lance together, it's Lance making the first move. When I put Lance and Justin together, Lance is the more dominant of the two. Haven't really looked at the other pairings I've written, but it's clear to me that in these two cases, I want Lance to take the lead because essentially I see him as the 'weaker' of the two. With Chris, Lance is at a disadvantage because of age, mostly, and 'life experience'. With Justin, hmm, I think I *have* to see Justin as the less proactive partner in order to achieve some kind of Cosmic Balance. I mean, he's **Justin Timberlake**.
I think this is probably because I don't like/feel entirely comfortable with inequality in relationships, and have to do whatever it takes to balance the relationship, if there is an imbalance to begin with. (I suspect that for other people, this would actually take the form of deliberately *emphasizing* the inequality and exploring it.)
Also, I don't, I think, write pairings in which they have sexually immutable roles (the nearest to a definite Top/Bottom distinction is in Lambs—where admittedly, Lance is always bossy, but not always on top!). I like to think that my boys, whichever boys they be, take turns topping. Or, well, maybe they don't take *turns*, exactly, they just do whichever they prefer at the time. Comes back to the same thing—I don't like the idea of relationships in which there is a set pattern. They have to share stuff—sex here, I suppose, standing for all kinds of other aspects of the relationship.
Another point: I find it easier to write explicit slash than I ever found writing explicit het*. (This is something that cropped up in one of the slash panels at Redemption.) And here, I'm pretty sure it's precisely because I'm not obviously involved in the scene—I am, as a female, necessarily, an observer and not plausibly a participant. I found it difficult to get the balance, in het scenes, between writing something that I would find a turn-on, and revealing too much entirely personal information. As a reader, too, I required much more precise targeting when reading het: if the female partner has a reaction that I don't share, or enjoys something that leaves me indifferent, it's harder to remain involved. Again, with slash, I'm not 'in there' in the same way. And because I'm an observer, because I can't identify closely with either male, I can identify with both. I think perhaps that it comes back to the disliking of set patterns...
So there's a modicum of self-examination. Thoughts, anyone? How is it for you?
* strictly speaking, I think I'm mostly a writer who prefers not to get too explicit, but sometimes, well, sometimes the porn *is* the story.
turps33 was wondering where the pop meta is... I dunno that I'm up to starting off any topics that fit the definition she and withdiamonds have suggested, but I have been doing some vague musings about writing, and possibly someone else might like to muse along with me? If we stick to popslash, we'll all know who we're talking about.I've been thinking about this for a while: I think it stems from one of the Writing Memes that goes around every so often. There was a question in there along these lines: which of your stories is the most revealing?
You see, I never used to think I was *in* my stories. When I was a Trekkie it wasn't really the kind of discussion that tended to happen, at least, not between Dataphiles, and I didn't really think about it, I just wrote what seemed to me to be something that was worth writing. But of late, I have at least begun to notice that I am indeed in there.
It can be in the simple things - like, if I have Justin admiring the pretty picture Lance makes when he's eating a strawberry, that's mostly me in there thinking it would be awful nice to see Lance eating a strawberry. Yes. I mean, I think it's obvious that if I'm trying to present a hot image, I need to believe it's a hot image. Why are so many of us delighted by fics involving masturbation, especially masturbation-with-an-observer? I'm pretty sure that's the same kind of thing.
The next step down, though, is to notice the way my own preferences come through. See, when I put Chris and Lance together, it's Lance making the first move. When I put Lance and Justin together, Lance is the more dominant of the two. Haven't really looked at the other pairings I've written, but it's clear to me that in these two cases, I want Lance to take the lead because essentially I see him as the 'weaker' of the two. With Chris, Lance is at a disadvantage because of age, mostly, and 'life experience'. With Justin, hmm, I think I *have* to see Justin as the less proactive partner in order to achieve some kind of Cosmic Balance. I mean, he's **Justin Timberlake**.
I think this is probably because I don't like/feel entirely comfortable with inequality in relationships, and have to do whatever it takes to balance the relationship, if there is an imbalance to begin with. (I suspect that for other people, this would actually take the form of deliberately *emphasizing* the inequality and exploring it.)
Also, I don't, I think, write pairings in which they have sexually immutable roles (the nearest to a definite Top/Bottom distinction is in Lambs—where admittedly, Lance is always bossy, but not always on top!). I like to think that my boys, whichever boys they be, take turns topping. Or, well, maybe they don't take *turns*, exactly, they just do whichever they prefer at the time. Comes back to the same thing—I don't like the idea of relationships in which there is a set pattern. They have to share stuff—sex here, I suppose, standing for all kinds of other aspects of the relationship.
Another point: I find it easier to write explicit slash than I ever found writing explicit het*. (This is something that cropped up in one of the slash panels at Redemption.) And here, I'm pretty sure it's precisely because I'm not obviously involved in the scene—I am, as a female, necessarily, an observer and not plausibly a participant. I found it difficult to get the balance, in het scenes, between writing something that I would find a turn-on, and revealing too much entirely personal information. As a reader, too, I required much more precise targeting when reading het: if the female partner has a reaction that I don't share, or enjoys something that leaves me indifferent, it's harder to remain involved. Again, with slash, I'm not 'in there' in the same way. And because I'm an observer, because I can't identify closely with either male, I can identify with both. I think perhaps that it comes back to the disliking of set patterns...
So there's a modicum of self-examination. Thoughts, anyone? How is it for you?
* strictly speaking, I think I'm mostly a writer who prefers not to get too explicit, but sometimes, well, sometimes the porn *is* the story.
no subject
Date: 2007-03-06 05:48 pm (UTC)For me, the Cosmic Balance thing isn't really a question of "It's all Justin's fault therefore he needs to be Humbled", but there *is* an inequality there (particularly in post-Sync stories) as you've so clearly pointed out, and I need to have that dealt with somehow.
For me, the way to redress the balance between superstar Justin and mere celebrity Lance is to play up the insecurity on Justin's side, or perhaps make him the less sexually confident of the two. Which strikes me as not implausible, given that Justin appears to be essentially a serial monogamist (with, probably, periods of opportunity in between the long-term relationships). I can make him into a Justin who wonders if he ought to have had experience with *more* people in order to be equal to Lance in that respect (even if I'm writing a Lance who hasn't actually had sex with everyone within radius!).
The insecurity business is also an aspect of Justin-characterisation that I like, because it strikes me that a part of his *appeal* is that he needs the audience's adoration, as well as revelling in it, and he *needs* the approval of people he admires, too. (That may be less true today than it was five years ago...) Whereas Lance seems to do what he wants to do and not worry particularly whether the world approves. The same differential would certainly apply in a present-day Timbertrick, though I doubt I'll be writing one.
no subject
Date: 2007-03-06 06:40 pm (UTC)I knew Timbertrick would be hard to write, which why I never attempted before, but I really wanted to because I loved reading it. I had ideas of my own I wanted to write that I haven't seen. :D
I want to have multiple sides of Justin displayed in the story and not just the obvious personality traits to get the story moving along. However, I know that I don't want to do the Everything-Is-Justin's-fault either and I'm trying to find something that will counteract it.
I find it difficult to write Chris because he shows so much of himself, yet at the same time doesn't. I could see him getting into a imbalanced relationship, but because of the way I perceive Chris, it would be unlikely, or wouldn't last long.
Which makes me wonder how to make a somewhat h/c fic work. He has such a strong personality, with a sort of, brittleness, jadedness? I'm not sure of the word I want to use, but I hope you understand. Anyway, sometimes I see vulnerability to him, a glimpse that makes me want to squish him. I want to try to explore that side without, as someone told me, feminism him. Chris isn't very feminine. :P
Hmm, I'm not even sure I've said all I wanted to say... But you got me thinking and thank you for making me stop for second to do it. :D
/rambling XD
no subject
Date: 2007-03-06 11:07 pm (UTC)Ther's an interesting balance with Timbertrick, I think - in the early days the 'power' is with Chris because of the age difference, and that's what has to be counterweighted in the story; in a more recent setting, the 'power' is with Justin because of the enormous degree of success he's enjoying. The balancing act is quite a different one, so I suspect it matters a lot exactly where along the timeline you set the story. Presumably there's a point somewhere in there where they're at equilibrium?
no subject
Date: 2007-03-06 11:51 pm (UTC)I think around between NSA and Celebrity there might be equal footing. But I'm not sure, I was distracted by many RL things around that time. :( However, I think it'll be hard to morph their relationship when needed. Throughout time, I'm sure there were little things that happened where the power levels went up and down, and then the big moments where it more extreme.
I'm going to go look at some behind scenes videos for inspiration. :)
BTW, I've seen people mention Chris looking pissed at an awards show once with the guys, do you know why? I think it was for the VMAs.
no subject
Date: 2007-03-07 08:36 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-03-07 01:51 pm (UTC)Exactly! Justin's issues are a huge part of his appeal for me, otherwise he'd just be this boring Golden Child. And you're right, his issues can be the factor that balances things out to some extent. I think the experiences they had as NSYNC, the success, means the other guys have a built-in confidence not dependent on what their status is these days. And while Justin is more confident and relaxed than he was five years ago, he still seems to have the most need for cntinuing success and approval. Although I'm mostly thinking about Chris, Joey and Lance. I can't begin to fathom JC at this point in time.
no subject
Date: 2007-03-08 11:08 am (UTC)As for JC... he's pretty much unfathomable, isn't he. But, in that recent series of radio interviews, rather adorable!