Torchwood (again)
Feb. 7th, 2008 10:31 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
pensnestA mixture of my reactions and a few Thoughts.
Jack - cannot seem to relate to anyone (except possibly Owen, though I wouldn't bet on it) in a not-sexual manner. (His instant sympathy for the Creature was right in theory but... I dunno, it didn't really convince me.) Note his instant there-be-sex-here interaction with Rhys's assistant. The too-close-to-Gwen stuff... it's as if he really doesn't know how to get through to anyone except on a sexual wavelength, when what he needs to do is Be The Boss and Make The Right Decisions. This ought to be his downfall one of these days, it'd be good for him. Although the "This is quite homo-erotic" line left me gasping for breath, I was laughing so hard.
Owen - surely not as oblivious as he seemed. He ain't stoopid. I think he knew exactly what Tosh was trying to say, and was deliberately ignoring her for (good?) reasons of his own. He hasn't been such a bastard this season, and I'd like to think that's going to continue. OTOH, good for Tosh for actually asking him out instead of mooning about the place... even though she did get very tentative and doormatty about it. She was a much stronger person last week.
Rhys - *loves!* A Decent Bloke, much better person than any of the Torchwood crew. Hit with first dismay (My lorry crashed), then distress (My driver/mate is dead) and then shock (That's my girl over there), and I liked his reactions throughout. Bit of a blunder, script-wise, over him *seeing an alien* and still hotly refusing to believe Gwen was serious when she told him what her job was, but I think not entirely unbelievable. I mean, if I saw something that could only be explained by "It's an alien life form", I'm still not sure I'd believe it. I'd want there to be another explanation - a hoax, or, there are more things in heaven and earth, etc. But there ought to have been a bit of some kind of rationalisation in the script, I think. The argument was great, and his scene at the end was made of love. I was, in fact, shouting at the tv "do not give him the drug", and it was such a relief when Gwen decided she wasn't prepared to do that. (And if they retconned him, how to explain the wound?) I like tv that gets me so involved I have to shout at the telly.
But should the villains of the piece have been retconned? If it's wrong to give the stuff to Rhys - and it is - then... It's still a very dubious moral issue - I can see the impracticality of taking the villains to court, but to relieve them of all knowledge of what they'd done? Don't like it at all. Dammit, make people take the consequences of their own bad behaviour! And how were they going to explain the bags of money - did Big-Ears give them a birthday present?
Besides, in practical terms, if aliens are among us, wouldn't it be better for Torchwood and for Earth if a few more of the civilian population were aware of them? Torchwood hardly qualifies as a secret organisation these days, not when (in 2:01) old ladies on the street can see them pursuing aliens hurtling past in fast cars, and shake their heads and mutter about it. So the retcon... handy narrative re-set device, but not actually the practical thing for Torchwood to be doling out right, left and centre.
Not convinced the team could find a way to incinerate a giant meatbeast in the time it took for Owen to patch Rhys up, either, but that's a minor issue. Perhaps they burned the warehouse to the ground? (Reprehensible visions of giant barbecue...)
Ianto - not *quite* such perfect Ianto-commentary in this episode as in others of late, as the whale lines didn't all work, for me, but not far off. We could release a single, indeed. I loved his first interaction with a villain - looking as though he was about to pull a Health and Safety Inspector's ID card out of his pocket, and tazering the guy instead. And his ruthless and timely tazerings later gave me much, much joy. Go, Ianto! I loved the way his relationship with Jack was an unspoken mirror for the 'loud' emotions expressed between Gwen and Rhys (by 'loud' meaning 'unsubtle', but not in a bad way).
I liked this a lot. I liked it for the way it grabbed at my emotions and made me react with laughter, satisfaction, worry, pity, fear... Thoroughly enjoyed it.
Jack - cannot seem to relate to anyone (except possibly Owen, though I wouldn't bet on it) in a not-sexual manner. (His instant sympathy for the Creature was right in theory but... I dunno, it didn't really convince me.) Note his instant there-be-sex-here interaction with Rhys's assistant. The too-close-to-Gwen stuff... it's as if he really doesn't know how to get through to anyone except on a sexual wavelength, when what he needs to do is Be The Boss and Make The Right Decisions. This ought to be his downfall one of these days, it'd be good for him. Although the "This is quite homo-erotic" line left me gasping for breath, I was laughing so hard.
Owen - surely not as oblivious as he seemed. He ain't stoopid. I think he knew exactly what Tosh was trying to say, and was deliberately ignoring her for (good?) reasons of his own. He hasn't been such a bastard this season, and I'd like to think that's going to continue. OTOH, good for Tosh for actually asking him out instead of mooning about the place... even though she did get very tentative and doormatty about it. She was a much stronger person last week.
Rhys - *loves!* A Decent Bloke, much better person than any of the Torchwood crew. Hit with first dismay (My lorry crashed), then distress (My driver/mate is dead) and then shock (That's my girl over there), and I liked his reactions throughout. Bit of a blunder, script-wise, over him *seeing an alien* and still hotly refusing to believe Gwen was serious when she told him what her job was, but I think not entirely unbelievable. I mean, if I saw something that could only be explained by "It's an alien life form", I'm still not sure I'd believe it. I'd want there to be another explanation - a hoax, or, there are more things in heaven and earth, etc. But there ought to have been a bit of some kind of rationalisation in the script, I think. The argument was great, and his scene at the end was made of love. I was, in fact, shouting at the tv "do not give him the drug", and it was such a relief when Gwen decided she wasn't prepared to do that. (And if they retconned him, how to explain the wound?) I like tv that gets me so involved I have to shout at the telly.
But should the villains of the piece have been retconned? If it's wrong to give the stuff to Rhys - and it is - then... It's still a very dubious moral issue - I can see the impracticality of taking the villains to court, but to relieve them of all knowledge of what they'd done? Don't like it at all. Dammit, make people take the consequences of their own bad behaviour! And how were they going to explain the bags of money - did Big-Ears give them a birthday present?
Besides, in practical terms, if aliens are among us, wouldn't it be better for Torchwood and for Earth if a few more of the civilian population were aware of them? Torchwood hardly qualifies as a secret organisation these days, not when (in 2:01) old ladies on the street can see them pursuing aliens hurtling past in fast cars, and shake their heads and mutter about it. So the retcon... handy narrative re-set device, but not actually the practical thing for Torchwood to be doling out right, left and centre.
Not convinced the team could find a way to incinerate a giant meatbeast in the time it took for Owen to patch Rhys up, either, but that's a minor issue. Perhaps they burned the warehouse to the ground? (Reprehensible visions of giant barbecue...)
Ianto - not *quite* such perfect Ianto-commentary in this episode as in others of late, as the whale lines didn't all work, for me, but not far off. We could release a single, indeed. I loved his first interaction with a villain - looking as though he was about to pull a Health and Safety Inspector's ID card out of his pocket, and tazering the guy instead. And his ruthless and timely tazerings later gave me much, much joy. Go, Ianto! I loved the way his relationship with Jack was an unspoken mirror for the 'loud' emotions expressed between Gwen and Rhys (by 'loud' meaning 'unsubtle', but not in a bad way).
I liked this a lot. I liked it for the way it grabbed at my emotions and made me react with laughter, satisfaction, worry, pity, fear... Thoroughly enjoyed it.
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no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 11:48 am (UTC)(also, dear lord Jesus *please* could they stop with the attempting to crowbar Jack/Gwen UST into a show that DOES NOT HAVE ANY. They've *never* had any ST to be U about. It would be quite nice if they used that as character development for Jack, finally finding a new way of relating to people.)
There were a few plot wobbles, but I *adore* Rhys, and wanted to smack Gwen less at the end of the episode than I have for the whole rest of the show, so I count that as a win.
And yes, with the enjoyable rollercoaster element - it's good enough to have me engaged.
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 01:18 pm (UTC)Ooh, good point.
also, dear lord Jesus *please* could they stop with the attempting to crowbar Jack/Gwen UST into a show that DOES NOT HAVE ANY.
THANK YOU! I was just bitching about that in my journal (heavily, I might add) as well.
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 05:45 pm (UTC)I liked Gwen+Rhys here, because we got a lot showing us (a) that she does love/trust/respect him and (b) why. Rhys is wonderful.
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 01:19 pm (UTC)Oooh thanking you! I'm so glad that wasn't just me then.
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 10:22 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 10:25 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 04:10 pm (UTC)I really liked that, because his reaction to the creature was pure 'what would the Doctor do?'. Starting from The Empty Child, the Doctor has been influencing his character, and I think Jack genuinely admires the Doctor and wants to be more like him because he thinks it's a better way to live his life. It was a very Doctor reaction to the creature -- it's the empathy and respect for life that the Doctor woke in him that wasn't a big part of Jack's makeup before.
it's as if he really doesn't know how to get through to anyone except on a sexual wavelength, when what he needs to do is Be The Boss and Make The Right Decisions.
And this is why he's been shot in the head by more than one member of his team. Really, at that point, most people would start to question their personnel skills and whether they were suited to a position in management. :-)
Not convinced the team could find a way to incinerate a giant meatbeast in the time it took for Owen to patch Rhys up, either
Don't forget that Torchwood has access to some kick-ass alien tech. They managed to nor merely shoot down but *vapourise* a giant flying saucer, after all. And, okay, that was pre-destruction of the Canary Whard Torchwood, but I bet they still have stuff around that will do that.
And how were they going to explain the bags of money - did Big-Ears give them a birthday present?
I assume Torchwood will be, um, relieving them of the money for security purposes. They seem pretty good at tidying up the paperwork, and fighting aliens invasions can't be cheap.
So the retcon... handy narrative re-set device, but not actually the practical thing for Torchwood to be doling out right, left and centre.
Logic and practicality have never been Torchwood strong points (and by that I mean Torchwood the organization). Part of their charm for me is the ever-present level of incompetance and bad planning. It's a very *British* secret alien-fighting organization.
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 04:41 pm (UTC)*giggle* This reminds me about this fabulous post I bookmared ages ago about how Torchwood's actually financed :-)
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 05:55 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 06:09 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 10:25 pm (UTC)"Yes, Prime Minister."
*mutters* "Sounds awfully familiar."
"I beg your pardon, Prime Minister?"
"No, no. Nothing. Nothing at all."
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 10:29 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 05:54 pm (UTC)Jack's really more of a Maddening Heroic Type than a manager, isn't he...
Don't forget that Torchwood has access to some kick-ass alien tech.
I suppose it's reasonable that we can assume it, anyway. And to be fair, I wouldn't want the last five minutes of every programme to be 'how we cleaned up the mess'.
Part of their charm for me is the ever-present level of incompetence and bad planning.
It's quite a surprise when they do something properly, really!
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 05:36 pm (UTC)I really liked that, because his reaction to the creature was pure 'what would the Doctor do?'. Starting from The Empty Child, the Doctor has been influencing his character, and I think Jack genuinely admires the Doctor and wants to be more like him because he thinks it's a better way to live his life. It was a very Doctor reaction to the creature -- it's the empathy and respect for life that the Doctor woke in him that wasn't a big part of Jack's makeup before.
it's as if he really doesn't know how to get through to anyone except on a sexual wavelength, when what he needs to do is Be The Boss and Make The Right Decisions.
And this is why he's been shot in the head by more than one member of his team. Really, at that point, most people would start to question their personnel skills and whether they were suited to a position in management. :-)
Not convinced the team could find a way to incinerate a giant meatbeast in the time it took for Owen to patch Rhys up, either
Don't forget that Torchwood has access to some kick-ass alien tech. They managed to nor merely shoot down but *vapourise* a giant flying saucer, after all. And, okay, that was pre-destruction of the Canary Whard Torchwood, but I bet they still have stuff around that will do that.
And how were they going to explain the bags of money - did Big-Ears give them a birthday present?
I assume Torchwood will be, um, relieving them of the money for security purposes. They seem pretty good at tidying up the paperwork, and fighting aliens invasions can't be cheap.
So the retcon... handy narrative re-set device, but not actually the practical thing for Torchwood to be doling out right, left and centre.
Logic and practicality have never been Torchwood strong points (and by that I mean Torchwood the organization). Part of their charm for me is the ever-present level of incompetance and bad planning. It's a very *British* secret alien-fighting organization.
no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 09:48 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-02-07 10:26 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-02-10 09:54 pm (UTC)Bit of a blunder, script-wise, over him *seeing an alien* and still hotly refusing to believe Gwen was serious when she told him what her job was,
I THOUGHT THE SAME THING!!!
And if they retconned him, how to explain the wound?
And again, YES! He works in an office! How would they explain away a gunshot wound to the chest?? He is an awesome guy though, and I love him with Gwen. I wish Gwen would stop being all goopy eyed around Jack.
Re: the old woman knowing about Torchwood, no tim to incinerate the beast.... yes, yes, and more yes. That's the thing I dislike most about Torchwood (and Dr. Who) - So. Many. Plot holes!! I know it's sci fi, but still - things just don't make sense!
And his ruthless and timely tazerings later gave me much, much joy. Go, Ianto!
I LOVE MY IANTO!! In fact, I'm abou to go hunt down some nice, new icons of him.
Jack and Ianto's subtle relationship... I love it. I want more sex scenes (we saw Owen thrusting!), but I love the way they are in work. Quiet, understated, trading witty banter and not letting the relationship interfere with work (like Gwen and Rhys).
no subject
Date: 2008-02-11 09:03 am (UTC)I often get the feeling, with both Dr Who and Torchwood, that it's good storytelling and very poor worldbuilding. I don't think the writers are really science fiction people - did you see that 'Motorway' episode of Dr Who last season? Cool image, completely rubbish sci fi. To my mind, there's no reason at all why science fiction can't make sense.
That moment when Jack yelled for Ianto to go after the bad guys - when he'd just been fighting one of them - I loved that. No time to take a moment and have a cuddle (tho' I spose they were separated by Giant Flailing Meatbeast at the time), just get on with the job NOW! But yes, I love the relationship.